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Made in Dagenham

Coverage by Nobuhiro Hosoki

Story : A dramatization of the 1968 strike at the Ford Dagenham car plant, where female workers walked out in protest against sexual discrimination.

Opens Friday, November 19, 2010 (Limited 11/19)

Runtime:1 hr. 53

Interview with Sally Hawkins

 

(Sally Hawkins): Well, it’s her name in the film. She’s an amalgamation of several women; there wasn’t a Rita O’Grady. You have to speak to Simon Burke, the script writer about this. Probably he’s got some Irish influence.
 
(Q): So when Miranda Richardson was talking about the research she could do with the real Barbara, what was your approach then, Sally?
 
(Sally Hawkins): I had a lot of material at my fingertips really. It was the history and making sure I knew everything I could know about that, but then also then letting it go because my character didn’t know. It sort of hit her as the story went on and unfolded. So having to know that for certain for one part of my brain and then letting that go to actually act. But I met with three of the women at the time; I’d wanted to do that anyway just for me because it always gives you a bit of a hook in order to work from. I went to Dagenham to meet, they were very kind of enough to meet, three of the women who are all still living in Dagenham, who are all still friends. I don’t know why that sort of surprised me, but it did.
 
(Q): Well it is 42 years later.
 
(Sally Hawkins): Well yes, and these women very much involved together, and that’s what I really got from them, that they were all still great friends. That friendship was actually what gave them that strength, and that strength throughout the 20 years that this fight evolved. We come to this fight and how it all began in 1968 at the very top, but it wasn’t until 1982 that they got the regrade, so this fight spanned 20 years, more or less. There were several women at several points in different years that took that battle and ran with it.
 
(Q): She’s an ordinary woman, but Bob Hoskins, Albert, the union guy who’s really a closet feminist here, says to her “I knew we need somebody who can inspire them.” So how did you as an actor approach this woman who’s the most ordinary kind of woman, but yet can step up to the plate and be so, not just courageous, but smart. Like bringing out those pieces of fabric, the leather fabric at the meeting, or getting up at the union meeting and bringing up World War II and Britain.
 
(Q): I think it was a question that that was found in the moment. When you said she’s a very ordinary woman but that she has an incredible, as a lot of women do, are very practical and have to be. She’s very down to earth and she just deals with what she has to deal with in the moment. It just hits her and she has to learn very fast, and she sort of unearths this intelligence. She’s not really aware of her intelligence or strength and that she has this ability until she’s doing it and until she’s talking to those men and up there on that stage and that platform and with that sea of men in front of her and having to hold her own.

And that starts right back at that scene where she’s meeting the management and realizing that if she doesn’t say something in that moment at that point, and she just so happens to have this material in this bag, and it makes a very good point and she’s not afraid of using it, because it’s up to her. She realizes that actually she is being the spokesperson, and I think she’s chosen because perhaps she isn’t extraordinary, and because she does blend in. If you look at Rita in that crowd she’s probably somebody who wouldn’t perhaps make a fuss or wouldn’t speak out, and then suddenly she does and they’re all learning, Bob’s character as well, Albert. He’s learning and he is realizing, and he is one of those, like you say, he’s one of those enlightened men.
 
(Q): But even before that scene we see how she doesn’t speak up with that horrible teacher who just has her jaw dropping. And she comes out and says afterwards “I knew what I was going to say, but when he said that to me I couldn’t open my mouth.” And maybe that was the reason she decides later. Did you think that?

(Sally Hawkins): I think so. I think we all have those moments in our lives and I think it’s so clever about that scene and important, because you see how it’s mirrored in her personal life. She is talking on a political stage, she is having to hold her own, and learn very fast, and speak this political language that isn’t really known to her. She sort of has to get her head around that, but then it’s quite easy for her to cut herself off, her personal life from that, and not make it relate. And I think she realizes, like you say, she realizes that actually it can help with that, and in those situations that actually that is where it’s most important in our day to day lives. It’s on that level and that’s where you can influence not only your life but other people’s lives, like her kids.
 
(Q): Yeah, because then there are her dealings with her husband and her family, which is a whole different side. The guy who played her husband was great.
 
(Sally Hawkins): Danny. I’ve known Danny for years; I went to college with Danny, and he’s gorgeous.
 
(Q): And he was perfect.
 
(Sally Hawkins): He is. He’s very passionate about what he does and he’s very funny as well. He’s one of those people you just love being on set with. He just cares about his work, and when you trust somebody who’s working that way you can do anything. You can sort of just completely be absorbed in what you’re doing and trying to do with the scene, and not worry about all that other stuff. Like you said, it’s mirrored in every aspect of her life.

(Q): And when she says in that big fight they have right before she goes off in the end, when the men have lost their jobs, the whole factory’s shut down, and he says “Well I never beat you up.” And she goes “That’s the way it’s supposed to be. It’s rights, not privileges.” That’s really the theme of the move, isn’t it? Basic human rights.
 
(Sally Hawkins): Totally. Absolutely. I think we’ve all experienced that. We’ve all experienced discrimination and power struggles in our personal lives or in our working lives, and come across it to a greater or lesser extent every day. And relationships, that’s the balance of relationships and the balance of power whether you’re male or female. It’s about being human and the respect, and that just taps into something in us all, and I think that’s why it’s so important. I loved playing it.

(Q): What did the real women think of the film? Were they just delighted?
 
(Sally Hawkins): I think so. I know there have been several screenings and there were a few of them in Rome, actually. And speaking to Liz and Steven, the producers of the film who developed this film in its early stages, are saying they’re delighted.
 
(Q): What fun for them.
 
(Sally Hawkins): Yeah, you hope. And that’s the ultimate compliment; that’s what you want.
 
(Q): Is it because it’s Great Britain that there’s also this class element? We don’t want to see that in the United States or believe that there are different classes here. In America the dream is anybody can make it, no matter where you come from you can be on top. But here, that scene where Rosamund Pike’s Lisa Hopkins says to you “I went to Cambridge and my husband treats me like an idiot, and you’re one of those people I studied in history.” It’s just a great little scene.
 
(Sally Hawkins): It’s a beautiful scene, actually, and it was lovely to play it. But then I think we can think of women like that in our own lives, whether they’re our mothers or our grandmothers, or just friends or people who have just been huge inspirations to us. And I think that’s what’s so lovely about not just that moment but also about these women. Usually the ones that you don’t really know about are the ones that have that great influence on us, and the ones that just give you that push or that step up into the right direction, and I think we can all relate to women like that.

And what it lovely is that this relatively small story, although it had a huge, global impact at the time, is being told. I think when you can relate it to very normal women you realize that actually you can actually have an influence, and it is important to speak up when you need to speak up, and to say what is going on.
 
(Q): Did they come to you with this? Did you campaign when you heard about this role and said “I have to play this?” How did it happen?
 
(Sally Hawkins): I was very lucky that it just landed as a gift. I got a letter from Liz and Steven and a very early draft of the script.
 
(Q): That was after “Happy-Go-Lucky”?
 
(Sally Hawkins): I don’t think I’d won the Golden Globe at that point. It was during that period; it’s all a bit vague for me. I just saw Liz now; she said that she was talking to Steven about me at that time, so I couldn’t quite remember whether I’d got the letter. But I received this beautiful letter, which I’ve still got, and this script introducing themselves and the film and Rita and her story. You don’t have to read much of that matter to know that you want to do it. I didn’t know about these women, I’m ashamed to say, and not many people do of my generation and younger generations. I think that’s why stories like this are so inspiring when they existed in reality. I just thought I’d be an idiot not to.
 
(Q): And I just read in the production notes for this movie that it’s been announced you’re going to do Bernadette Devlin?

(Sally Hawkins): Yes, I hope that that still happens. I was just talking about it, actually.
 
(Q): A woman who is famous as some kind of a revolutionary.
 
(Sally Hawkins): Absolutely.
 
(Q): In Ireland.

(Sally Hawkins): Yes, and I’ll be working with Aisling Walsh, who’s been a huge influence for Aisling and her becoming a filmmaker and wanting to make films about extraordinary people in that way. So I really hope that that happens. It seems there’s a theme.
 
(Q): In America, if an actress says that she considers herself a feminist it’s kind of a career damning thing a lot of the time.
 
(Sally Hawkins): Really? That’s a shame.
 
(Q): It’s changing a little bit now with Amy Pohler and Tina Fey, but I was curious if did that make it at all a concern for you taking on a film that’s not overtly political but is certainly political?
 
(Sally Hawkins): No, no. That was never a thought. I just look at the script and the part, and I can’t really think like that. If that’s what I’m worried about then I should really probably not be doing this, and I’ve got to rethink my whole brain. And I would hate that to stop me from doing wonderful work, and I think I’m lucky to be thought of in that way and to be talking about really important issues with people like you.
 
(Q): Can you talk a little bit about the atmosphere on the set with all the women? It just looks like you were having so much fun. So much of the charm of the movie was that great group of women.
 
(Sally Hawkins): We were. It was hard work, but they are a great group of women. I remember at one point in filming, because another industry, it’s changing, but has been influenced and ruled by men. And to then look around at this extraordinary group of women when filming at one point, it did really move me, and I felt very proud. And I think a couple of years ago that might not have been the case, and especially a film that has garnered so much interest. It’s female led film and it’s about female issues, but actually when you sort of pick away at it it’s about human issues.
 
(Q): And it’s not really a male bashing movie.
 
(Sally Hawkins): No, not at all. It just happens to be about this collection of women having.
 
(Q): Which you could say about “For Colored Girls.”
 
(Q): Have you talked to Sally Field at all?
 
(Sally Hawkins): Somebody mentioned Sally Field and Norma Ray this morning. A friend of mine said when they read the script “Have you seen ‘Norma Ray’?” And I said no and they sent me the film, which I didn’t open, I didn’t watch, because I didn’t want to – I love Sally Field – until recently, actually. Until all the film had gone out, all the post-production, and I just came across it as I was moving, and then didn’t start watching it. And flood of tears; I went “Oh my god, is this too similar?”
 
(Q): That factory location had to inform you too. That was a dilapidated looking place.
 
(Sally Hawkins): And interestingly, the Hoover factory is in Wales, we got that location, and it went through a similar thing that Ford factory Dagenham did. The Ford factory in Dagenham, that was what Dagenham was built around, like the Hoover factory in Merthyr, in deepest, darkest Wales is this beautiful 1920s building, and it’s now not being used. And a lot of the supporting artists in the film and in the factory were working in that factory but then they’re now redundant and it’s having a huge impact on the local industry and the local community there.
 
(Q): And they look great. I mean, they look like real workers.
 
(Sally Hawkins): Well they were until a couple of weeks ago.

(Q): Did you learn how to sew for this?
 
(Sally Hawkins): I did, yes. I wanted to do it and as soon as I heard that I was given this opportunity and knew that I was doing it and that we had the money, I was very lucky, I got this sort of very old, well I don’t know if you’d call it luck, but I wanted one that was as close to an industry machine as possible. And I still got it, and it’s this beautiful Bernina machine. I’m not very good.
 
(Q): You made your coat that you’re wearing today.

(Sally Hawkins): I wish I had. No, certainly not. I’d be earning a lot more money if I had. I was just about to learn how to dart, and I’ve done a very basic skirt, which I still need to hem. But I’m good friends with a teacher now, who’s a seamstress. I wanted to do that but I thought I should know how to sew.
 
(Q): What do you look for now that you’ve had this opportunity where you’re famous after winning the Golden Globe, to be able to sort of choose roles? When people offer you things do you know immediately, like with this movie? You had a relatively small part, but effective, in “Never Let Me Go.”
 
(Sally Hawkins): Of course more people know who you are, and that’s great, but in terms of career, it’s weird. Lots of people said “You must be inundated with scripts,” and there are only so many really well written scripts and brilliant projects in the world at one point. And whether it comes to you or not, I’ve been lucky that I don’t really sort of see it or would have to be a lead in it. If it’s a good script and it’s got great people you want to work with then that’s great, but I don’t see how you can plan, because it could change every week. For example, I don’t know what I’m doing after “Mrs. Warren’s Profession.” Hopefully I will soon.
 
(Q): You used to contribute some writing in BBC radio comdey. Was there anything you’re working on with Nigel?
 
(Sally Hawkins): Yes, there was a bit. I always love doing that. Mike Lee, his way of working is very particular to his films, and you can’t really transpose that onto other films. You’d be working in this isolated bubble if you did, which is not really the point. But if other actors want to work in that way it’s always really useful to sort of leapfrog you into a scene or to make it seamless as much as it can be so the script sort of merges with character and it doesn’t become script. I like working that way, I love it, because for me it gives it a richness and it makes it like a play a bit, and you forget where the script is. It’s always quite frightening when you see the script on the page and you want to lift it to life and that always helps, and Nigel was very open to that and making it so it has that sort of docu thing going on sometimes.
 
(Q): Can you think of a scene in the movie where you can look at that and say that’s something we just thought of on the day?
 
(Sally Hawkins): Definitely in the factory with the girls and it was a lot of fun. I think to get that fun we had to play around, and I think the best moments…
 
(Q): When the man comes in and everybody screams?

(Sally Hawkins): Yeah, that’s one. Poor Bob.
 
(Q): They’re patting him on the butt.
 
(Sally Hawkins): He loved it. Couldn’t get enough. Don’t quote me on that. Especially with Danny, because we worked together with Mike, and so you have that relationship, that ease, where you can improvise. So many actors and so many people work so many different ways, and Danny loves working that way, so especially early on in the film when we were playing around and I think there’s that moment at night where we’re drunk and we’re dancing and we fall over. That just happened in the play of it, and when you’ve got somebody you completely trust it’s lovely. When I watch a film or when you watch theater, you love to see that spontaneity, because that’s when I really sort of sings to you. That’s when it’s really seamless and it’s real.
 
(Q): Most alive.
 
(Sally Hawkins): Yeah.
 
(Q): And who did the beautiful black jacket?
 
(Sally Hawkins): This is quite old, actually. It’s Costume National.

 

End.