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Man in the Chair

Coverage by Nobuhiro Hosoki

 

- Michael, were there tough challenges for you directing him?

(Michael Schroeder) Absolutely not.  Christopher and I were always on the same page about this character. When he first called me from Connecticut, he had ideas about Flash's walk, and how he had a hump to his back etc. And then I had always seen Flash as a man wearing a hat, and so we had a good discussion about that because Christopher wanted to wear a hat too. So, we agreed on this little pork pie hat, which the crew used to wear all the time in the old days. I think if anything, Chris brought some of my scenes that maybe were a line or two too long and helped me trim those off. Because when I was writing it, I didn't have the pleasure of seeing the nuance of Christopher Plummer or his look or what he could do. I had a lot of fun writing that role, and his dialogue.  And then, when I would watch these scenes on my monitor, what I call, quite frankly, the genius of Plummer, the magic would just happen. You go mad.

- You said you had this idea for a film in the mid nineties, but what took you so long to actually finalize it?

I sort of got hung up for about a decade directing action movies and thriller films and was very busy making a living. And, at the same time I was fighting against my own resume because I wanted to do movies like "Man in the Chair" and I was doing movies like "Cyborg 2" and "Cyborg 3." Then I had this sort of epiphany that I wanted to do more with my life, so I sold my house and my cars and got a little single apartment on Detroit Street, and I started to write.

- It makes it sound like he was terribly wealthy doesn't it?

(Michael Schroeder) No, I wasn't wealthy. The bank owned my house, not me. I just wanted to get away from the mortgage. But, to answer your question, when I got ready to write and wanted to do something different, I remembered about the motion picture home [a retirement home set up by the Motion Picture & Television Fund for those involved or previously involved in the entertainment industry]. Johnson Winters had told me about this place and mentioned that you could actually crew up a movie out of there. And I thought, well there's an untapped source. I wanted to write something fresh because everything's been written. So I thought, why don't I tap that source, bring a boy into it. At first the person that lived in the motion picture home was a retired actor, but then, again, I thought it would be more interesting if he was a blue collar, below the line guy because there are so many of them that don't get to work anymore in the business. And, as I started writing, it just started to grow. It became a more layered script about ageism. Then I started doing the research on the nursing home and was blown away by the neglect problem. It sort of evolved into a sobering subject but told in a humorous, entertaining way so you weren't so blown away by the subject matter, but instead, were actually moved by it.

- It was great that you took on the whole subject of mentorship and the passing on of knowledge.

(Michael Schroeder) Yeah. That is something that is lacking tremendously in this country.

- Have you mentored anyone yourself Chris?

(Christopher Plummer)  Oh, no. Not consciously. I wouldn't know how to do that.

- Well, you have younger friends that listen to you don't you? That's mentoring.

(Christopher Plummer)  I suppose so, yes, if they do listen.

- Mike, how did you bring Chris into the project? Was he your first choice to play the role?

(Michael Schroeder) Absolutely. When we finally had real money, a real flashing green light if you will, Chris was right there with who I wanted. And, thank goodness the agent liked the script and passed it onto Chris because sometimes they don't. I mean we did have to make an offer. We had to be legitimate. I didn't ask Chris to read the script for free, and say "Hey, do you want to come join me at film camp?" No. I said, "This is a job and this is a role," and thank god he responded to it. That was a great day when Carter Cohen from ICM called me and said "Christopher Plummer loves your script. Let's make a deal."

- Chris, I know that this is a unique script and a unique experience, but are you finding other scripts out there with roles that are fun and important in the same way?

(Christopher Plummer)  Yes. More and more I'm finding them on screen, but there are not that many written, certainly not the sort of star character roles like this one. There are some interesting character roles in films that are much briefer in length, but this one carries the movie, along with that devil of a scene-stealer Michael Angarano [plays Cameron in the film]. That child should be jailed just for being a scene-stealer. I hate him. No, actually, I love working with him. He's very funny. Funny kid.

- Well, isn't that mentoring? He must have gotten something out of working with you.

(Christopher Plummer)  He mentored me! He was just barely 18 when he made it, and I said, "How many films have you made?" And he said, without batting an eye, "Twenty five features already."

- Speaking of mentoring, you've worked with giants like Elia Kazan and Jean Cocteau.

(Christopher Plummer)  Yes. I've had many mentors such as Kazan and even Kama Savitski, who I was lucky enough to work under when I was 18, and those are extraordinary giants of the theatre.

And in movies too, John Houston, Orsen Wells, whom I've never been directed by, but whom I've known well and worked with several times on the screen. God, I love him.  I was hoping to do a film with him because we were going to produce, yet again, Julius Cesar in brown shirt instead of black shirt. He said "I want you to play Marc Antony and come in as a producer with me." I thought, "Well, I would do anything. I would pay to work with Orsen because he's such a funny, witty man." Of course, the thing never got off the ground, as was always his way.

I always loved him because he never had a front man to charm the backers. He had to do it himself, and then he got so sick of charming them that he would call them a bunch of philistines and then leave the room and of course had no money. He was so shattered by these dreadful people that he had been charming.

(Michael Schroeder)Chris has "mentees" [people he has mentored] all over the place, he just doesn't know about them. There was an impromptu birthday party thrown for Christopher during our filming, and there were a bunch of elite actors there, Al Pacino being one of them. And Al Pacino pulled me aside and told me "Chris Plummer is the man. He is the best actor in the world." I got from Al that his insider experience on the film where Christopher played Mike Wallace was a great experience for Al Pacino. Now this is Al Pacino. This isn't some acting coach or some student. This is a guy that I really admire as an actor praising this guy [motions to Chris].

- So do you find yourself more compelled to do theatre than as opposed to film because you are saying there haven't been as exciting films or parts?

(Christopher Plummer)  Well, there never is a great part on the screen. There is only one every 20 years compared to the theatre where you can pull them out of a hat. The two mediums are totally different. The great roles on the screen are the ones that don't talk while the great roles in the theatre are the ones that talk and talk beautifully. So, if you love words, which I do, than you are attracted, of course, always to the theatre where you can do the great classics and hopefully the good new plays that come along.

- Do you have any stage work planned for the future?

(Christopher Plummer)  Yes, I do. I take a year to do movies and the next year I do theatre. I've always done that.  It's just very unfortunate because, when you do the theatre, the movie world thinks you're dead, and when you do the movies, the theatre world thinks you're dead. So it's a difficult thing to mix, but I think it's terribly important.

It keeps you in tune with your craft, and variety is the spice of life. I would hate to be in one medium. To do nothing but movies as an actor would be desperately boring.

- Well, it's the lack of having the feedback of a live audience.

(Christopher Plummer)  You've got to have that because the crew isn't going to love you.

- It's interesting that the majority of the actors in "The Man in a Chair" were stage trained actors. I think they bring a certain light to it, a certain validation to their roles from their stage training. A lot of these young guys should go out and do a play and feel that pressure and feel that crowd.

(Christopher Plummer)    Acting in the theatre also teaches you how to color something on the screen. Out of these so-called movie stars we watch, some are very good, and others have  a monotony to them because they don't know what happened in the last scene. They don't know how to orchestrate their performances or the script that they're doing. You read a play and you know where the climaxes are and where the coda is, and that's very important to know, and you really learn that in the theatre.

- When you're working on a film that is not shot in sequence and you are going into a scene, do you prepare to do that scene by working on the scene prior to that on your own, in your own technique?

(Christopher Plummer)  Yes.  You do that secretly at home. I learned not to talk about that in front of everybody else like a lot of people in our business do.

You've got to know what happens before. I mean when we shot Hamlet many years ago in Denmark, we didn't have much time, and of course the second scene was the death scene. That was on the call sheet, "Hamlet's Death. Tomorrow." Please. I haven't begun to live yet how do I know how to die?

- When you're working in front of a camera vs. on a stage, what's the difference in your consciousness of what you are projecting and your physicality?

(Christopher Plummer)  Well, there really isn't any difference at all except that on the screen you must pick out silent moments that you can't necessarily do on the stage. If you do too many silent moments on the stage, the audience will leave. On the screen, you have to fight for your moment in front of the camera and make sure you know exactly when to make that particular look that tells the audience what is inside you even if the lines that you speak may be totally different.

 Something has to come through behind the lines. That's really the only difference, but it's a big major difference. I learned that after many, many attempts at acting in films, but it does come eventually.

- Do you feel that there is a different kind of reflection that occurs for an audience in the theatre or in film?

(Christopher Plummer)  Yes

- And what would that be?

(Christopher Plummer)  Well, first of all, the audience in the theatre pays more for their seats, so they are more likely to shut up and listen. At the same time, they don't have much time to reflect because things are happening so fast. They reflect afterwards.

The audience in a film is rather soothed by the fact that it's all visual, by the scenery, no matter where it is or no matter what emotional act is going on in front of them.  Everything's slowed down.

 You'll notice if you only go to see a musical on the stage, and then you see that same musical on film, particularly if it's in color, it slows down on the screen. It's much faster on stage.

- In light of that, I thought that your cast was interesting. I kept thinking that I knew all those faces there that were in the old-folks home.?Christopher, it must have been interesting for you get a chance to revisit people that you haven't worked with before or haven't worked with in a long time and for you to get to work with a whole crew of people that are of the generation that brings a sort of quality of acting to this movie that might not have been there if you had worked with another type of cast. How was that for you?

(Christopher Plummer)  It was just great, and I think it was beautifully cast. I actually knew some of the people at the home, who aren't there now anymore because they're dead, but Rowdy McDowell was an old pal of mine and he did a lot for the Motion Picture Home. One time he asked me if I wanted to go with him up there to visit Mary Astor. I couldn't believe that she ended up in the motion picture home, that great sort of beautiful star of the 20's and 30's. I didn't go because I thought it was rather gruesome, and I'm afraid I was a coward. But now, after my having seen it, and how comfortable and quite attractive it could be, my mind changed.

- Now Michael, how was it for you to cast?

(Michael Schroeder) First of all, they were so anxious to work. They never get a work call anymore. They hardly even talk to their agents. So, they were really appreciative of the part even though they were paid virtually nothing. They just wanted to work again. My casting director would just bring me people that wanted to do it, and I chose faces. I specifically didn't choose faces like Mickey Roonie or Dick Van Dyke for those smaller roles. Those are legendary actors, and I wouldn't put Christopher Plummer in the role of Speed either, it just wouldn't work. I didn't want those people to be personified by a star quality, so I chose people that made you think "Why do I know him? Oh that's Mickey Rooney." We did that on purpose because these are such great actors. One thing I learned from Christopher Plummer is that he loves to hide within a character, and you lose Christopher in that guy. You see Flash, and for 107 minutes that's another persona, and so the other actors did that same thing. Ellen Geere is really talented that way. They were so good, and they just loved what the script said to them.

- Chris, did you stay in character even when the cameras weren't rolling to keep that character alive?

(Christopher Plummer)  Well, there was hardly a pause in the filming of this movie where I could drop it, but I don't do that, no. I quickly get out of the character.

?Michael Schroeder? I say action right, and he starts walking and he says "I was talking out of my ass," and then I'll say cut and he'll go, "How was that dear boy?"

(Christopher Plummer)  Yeah, I hate hanging onto a character.

- Can you talk a little bit about the casting of Robert Wagner. I thought he was the perfect choice for the movie.

(Michael Schroeder) Again, I got lucky. He did not want to do a film before Christmas. He had promised his family he was not going to work, but his manager said, "You ought to read the script; it's a pretty good script." So he read it on the way to a funeral in Washington DC, and as soon as he landed in DC he said, "I'm in," and he was great.

He was one of the guys that had to float. He'd work a day here and then we'd bring him in five days later and he'd work a day here, and he was really great about it where some people would say "Look, you got me one day."

There was an alternate ending where Taylor Moss came to the theatre and brought in a legendary director, and we just could never get that thing hooked up. I'm so glad we didn't because it's not a good ending. But Robert said, "I'm your designated hitter. Whenever you need me, I'll come and do that scene."

- Had you ever worked with him before?

(Christopher Plummer)  No, but I knew him very well because I knew Natalie, and they were constantly getting remarried all the time.

??Can you tell us about the title of the film?

(Christopher Plummer)  Well, it's got a double meaning. The man in the chair is the director on a film. In the old days it was called a director's chair because it was only the director who had a chair. Now everyone has a chair. Third makeup has a chair.

And also, when I saw this character, Flash, at the beginning, I saw him as a man in a chair who was always sitting under this tree. So I had the title also as a description of him.

But as we worked it out, that chair became a bench because we wanted the boy there with him and some other stuff, so he's really like the man in the bench. That just doesn't roll off the tongue very well, so we left it man in the chair. It's more about the reference to the job.

- Could you talk about the kid actor Michael Angarano? He was just fantastic. It seems like he was like a sponge and absorbed a lot of the material from you and Christopher.

(Michael Schroeder) He's really natural. He'll just take the dialogue and get through it, but you believe his lines.

(Christopher Plummer)  He's got a little magic, Michael, he really does. He's a natural. He's totally instinctive. He doesn't have to worry about taking anytime to get into character, he already is. And he has an incredible sense of humor, which not a lot of young actors do.

(Michael Schroeder) And sense of mimicry right?

(Christopher Plummer)  Yes.  He can mimic.

- Did he imitate you?

(Christopher Plummer)  I'm sure he did. Not in front of me, but I'm sure he did.

(Michael Schroeder) He did all the time. That kid is going to blow up.

(Christopher Plummer)  Yes. He's going to be something. He just needs to work on his diction a little bit.

(Michael Schroeder)I think he's like a young Matthew Broderick. He has that magic. He can be funny or he can be serious. He just finished the 70 million dollar film with Jet Li and Jackie Chan. The first time they've ever been in the same film.

- Can we go back to your flash character Christopher? He seems a lot different from your demeanor. Where did he come from? Who did you base him off of?

(Christopher Plummer)  Well, a lot of old bums that I've known over the years, including some very good friends, and myself too. I went through a big drinking period. The people you meet in those bars year after year are some incredible characters, so it wasn't tough to draw on a few of them and make one out of them. And the voice is sort of a New York self-deprecating, bitter voice, very cynical.

- Your daughter is also a very talented actress. Is there any similarity in you having mentored her in some way?

(Christopher Plummer)  When I saw Amanda first on the stage in "Agnes of God," which she was absolutely extraordinary in, just frightening, I had no sort of feeling that she was part of my genes or my family.

It was another kind of talent all together. It had nothing to do with her mother or me. She suffered on her own, and consequently, it was a very unnerving and frightening experience but also marvelous because she was so frenzied and extraordinary in that role. How she did it every night I really don't know, but she did.

- Have you two worked together much?

(Christopher Plummer)  No, we never have. At first it was on purpose because we didn't want it to look like a family outing, but now I'm thinking it's the time to do it before I croak.

- Do you have something in mind that you'd like to do with her?

(Christopher Plummer)  Yes I do. I mean we have been offered plays together, which either we were not free to do or we decided "No," but I think "Major Barbara." I think she'd be marvelous as Barbara. She would give it a real eccentric kind of force, and I would like to do Underschaft, so maybe we could do that.

- You get remembered for specific films, but do you feel there are films that you've done that people forget about or overlook that you want people to see you in?

(Christopher Plummer)  Oh sure.

- What are some of those?

(Christopher Plummer)  Well, there are several little things that you wouldn't know because hardly anybody ever saw them. That's the sadness of little gems that nobody gets behind and pushes.

- So which ones do you think we should go find that people have not seen enough of? Could you tell us?

(Christopher Plummer)  It's hard. It's very hard. I'd much rather talk about other people's movies than the ones I've been in. I have very little affection for a lot of the ones I've done. They're not embarrassing, but I'm not balled over by them. I think I enjoyed doing Mike Wallace in "The Insider" because that was a very well made movie.

- Have you seen Mike Wallace?

(Christopher Plummer)  Yes. I know Mike Wallace, and although I was terrified that he would hate my performance, he evidently liked it. He didn't like the script because CBS got it in the neck, and they couldn't deny it because it was true.

- And what were some of the other films you were saying?
(Christopher Plummer)  You know I've made over 100 films, I don't know. Well, I guess "The Man Who Would be King," but everybody saw that.  There are little films, English films like "Aces High." That's a sweet movie, and you know it, so there's nothing that you don't know.

- No, but we want to know a list from you.

(Christopher Plummer)  Well I liked that movie, "Aces High," and I liked being in it. I wasn't particularly standing out in it, but I loved being in it. I thought it was a sensitively done film.

?Michael Schroeder?You're giving the Robert Weiss answer because films are like girlfriends. You like the one you're with the best.

- Well Michael, what are your favorites of his films?

(Michael Schroeder) Definitely "Man Who Would Be King," and, "Man in the Chair." That is my favorite Christopher Plummer film. He gets a lot of screen time, and I can't get enough of him. I've actually moved scenes in the film to get him back on the screen sooner because the film is alive when he's there. I also love "Insider." Those would be my big three.

- Are there any films that had a particular effect on you that made you change your perspective or informed your work?

(Michael Schroeder)"It's a Wonderful Life" had a major effect on me. The first film I saw was at a drive in. I remember it was called "The Guns in Navarone," and we were in a Plymouth station wagon. My mom had eight kids, four at the time, and I was the oldest. We were right next to the speaker and I was just mesmerized by Gregory Pack and that whole movie. Then I saw "Greatest Show on Earth" which I was blown away by. And then when I really started to get involved in film I was really affected by the "Raging Bull." I went to a matinee screening. I saw it with about five people and the power of that film had an enormous effect on me.

- And for yourself Christopher?

(Christopher Plummer)  Well, I grew up miles before he did, so I grew up on pictures. I also grew up in the province of Quebec, so I saw all the French films from France, and they became my favorites instead of the English movies, which I love because they were making that wonderful group of comedies in those days.

But the French were at their best in the 40's. They had all the great actors playing on screen that were in the theatre. Their performances were so rich and extraordinary that nobody got bored. Those films were magic. And the German films were wonderful too.

So they were a big influence on me screen wise. And I suppose, "The Third Man" was one of the best films ever made. What was the name of that wonderful director, who, to me, was the best English director that there was? Carole Reed! Oh, and another was that Irish movie with all the Abbey players, "Odd Man Out." So there are thousands of movies I love that I wasn't in. I wasn't out there to ruin them.

- Besides this guy being your favorite director of the moment (motions to MS), are there any other favorite directors you think of from over the years?

(Christopher Plummer) Well Kazan, Tyrone Guthrie, without question. One of the greatest directors ever. Kazan, the greatest for contemporary tragedy. He was marvelous at his time. I wish he'd gone into the classics because I think he could have done some of them and done some very interesting things with, particularly "Othello." In fact, when I was working with him he said, "I may do Othello. Do you want to play Iago?" And I said "With you? Yes." And he was going to get Sidney Poitier to play Othello, but then, it was very strange. Sidney, he was very smart. He said no because, it was in 1958, and he felt that Othello couldn't be thought of as a duke. Being a black actor at that time, he said, "I'd love to, but I think it's not the right time." It's such a delicate situation. He's right and he's wrong, but my god I'd like to have been in that production, but it never happened.

- And what was it about Sir Tyrone that you particularly liked?

(Christopher Plummer)  It was his enormous panache. How he dealt with people on the stage. How armies would cross the stage in a second. And he also was enormously witty and funny and no problems. It was just enormous fun. Ands that's what so many people in our business I find, sadly, don't have.

- Did you work with Kazan both on stage and film?

(Christopher Plummer)  No, just on stage.

-?Have you worked with any director both on stage and film?

(Christopher Plummer)  Yes. Sidney Lumet. He did "Stagestruck," which was my first movie. He gave me my first movie job, and then I did a terrible play called "Night of the Auk." A very pretentious play that only ran two weeks.

- How did Lumet's dealing with you as an actor differ on film vs stage?

(Christopher Plummer)  It was the same. Same exactly. He was excellent on the stage. He started on the stage. I wish he'd done more. It wasn't because of him that the play failed. It was the words.

- So what's next for both of you?

(Christopher Plummer)  Well, Michael seems to be dedicated to pushing this film of his. He's a terrible pusher, but thank god somebody's pushing this movie. And I'm going to go with Terry Gilliam and do his next movie, which is called "The Imaginarium of Doctor Parnassus." I am playing the doctor. Big chance for me. I have to wait until I'm nearly 80 to get a nice, big screen role.